School tells cop not to wear uniform to pick up his own kids

[Lanie]

http://news.yahoo.com/school-tells-cop-not-wear-uniform-pick-own-133405957.html

An elementary school principal in Mesa, Ariz. has asked a police officer not to wear his police uniform or his gun when he picks up his daughter at school, reports local Fox affiliate KSAZ.

The reason: it’s just too scary for some parents because the officer was — gasp! — carrying a gun.

The Daily Caller is not making this up.

The cop, SWAT officer Scott Urkov, is a police officer in Coolidge, about 40 miles from the Mesa. His daughter attends Entz Elementary School in the Phoenix suburb.

“One of our parents at the elementary school is a SWAT officer and he dropped his children off at school one day in full uniform, fully armed,” explained Mesa Unified School District spokeswoman Helen Hollands.

They're getting carried away. Don't people want a cop to come by their kid's school? I would. When people fear cops because they have guns, we have a real problem in this country.

[Adam]

Good grief.

[Gingersnap]

Why were the parents complaining? Were the kids curious? Is it too much trouble for the parents to either explain what police officers look like or to explain that police officers have children?

[Lanie]

Why were the parents complaining? Were the kids curious? Is it too much trouble for the parents to either explain what police officers look like or to explain that police officers have children?

I think our culture is getting so afraid of guns that they're even afraid of cops. It's not just liberals pushing the issue. It's stuff like Newtown.

[Gingersnap]

I think our culture is getting so afraid of guns that they're even afraid of cops. It's not just liberals pushing the issue. It's stuff like Newtown.

Guns do not spontaneously kill school children. Parents who act like that's within the realm of possibility are teaching their children to fear inanimate objects and that's not smart. Respect is one thing, superstitious fear is something else.

Every school should probably have mandatory firearm safety classes off and on for all 16 years of compulsory education.

[Adam]

Guns do not spontaneously kill school children. Parents who act like that's within the realm of possibility are teaching their children to fear inanimate objects and that's not smart. Respect is one thing, superstitious fear is something else.

Every school should probably have mandatory firearm safety classes off and on for all 16 years of compulsory education.

God, I only wish. Just think how many fewer kids would die each year from some terrible accident that was doubtless brought about by a failure to have a full understanding of the weapon they have encountered.

[Lanie]

For the sake of the parents who are so against guns, I wouldn't want to see a class be mandatory. I don't see a problem with offering it as an elective, but the school system needs to get its common sense back first. They're accusing little kids of being terrorists just for having play guns.

[Gingersnap]

For the sake of the parents who are so against guns, I wouldn't want to see a class be mandatory. I don't see a problem with offering it as an elective, but the school system needs to get its common sense back first. They're accusing little kids of being terrorists just for having play guns.

Then have a class about common safety issues of which firearms are a part. How many people stand stupidly about when others contact live wires, have arterial bleeding, catch on fire, choke, have objects stuck in them, and so on? Most people, that's who. It's not like the info isn't out there in a million little factoids but we haven't distilled it into a coherent, teachable form that goes from grade school through high school.

I got a lot from 4-H because they emphasize that stuff but very few kids are in 4-H. Safety should be a mandatory part of education and that will include stuff people don't like: guns, sexual coercion, drug/drink problems, Internet activity, etc.

However, despite advocating for this type of education, I am certain schools would somehow screw it up. Somehow, we always do. D.A.R.E perversely encouraged drug experimentation. Condom classes made no difference in pregnancy outcomes. Who knows what a gun violence/gun safety class would look like in the hands of public school educators?

[Lanie]

Then have a class about common safety issues of which firearms are a part. How many people stand stupidly about when others contact live wires, have arterial bleeding, catch on fire, choke, have objects stuck in them, and so on? Most people, that's who. It's not like the info isn't out there in a million little factoids but we haven't distilled it into a coherent, teachable form that goes from grade school through high school.

I got a lot from 4-H because they emphasize that stuff but very few kids are in 4-H. Safety should be a mandatory part of education and that will include stuff people don't like: guns, sexual coercion, drug/drink problems, Internet activity, etc.

However, despite advocating for this type of education, I am certain schools would somehow screw it up. Somehow, we always do. D.A.R.E perversely encouraged drug experimentation. Condom classes made no difference in pregnancy outcomes. Who knows what a gun violence/gun safety class would look like in the hands of public school educators?

Actually, that is a good idea.

I don't know if we should completely blame the public schools for the outcome of things. I don't remember my DARE class ever suggesting experimentation of drugs. My niece's didn't appear to either. They told and showed us in class how to use a condom (using an object, not the real thing). Is it the fault of public schools that some people refuse to wear condoms, will take them off too soon, and even reuse them? No, it's not the fault of public schools. They don't teach that. This goes back to personal responsibility. Right now, all they teach in schools about guns is to stay away from them.

[Adam]

Actually, that is a good idea.

I don't know if we should completely blame the public schools for the outcome of things. I don't remember my DARE class ever suggesting experimentation of drugs.

"Forbidden fruit" factor.

My niece's didn't appear to either. They told and showed us in class how to use a condom (using an object, not the real thing). Is it the fault of public schools that some people refuse to wear condoms, will take them off too soon, and even reuse them? No, it's not the fault of public schools. They don't teach that. This goes back to personal responsibility. Right now, all they teach in schools about guns is to stay away from them.

Aaaaannnnndddd, see above.

[Gingersnap]

Actually, that is a good idea.

I don't know if we should completely blame the public schools for the outcome of things. I don't remember my DARE class ever suggesting experimentation of drugs. My niece's didn't appear to either. They told and showed us in class how to use a condom (using an object, not the real thing). Is it the fault of public schools that some people refuse to wear condoms, will take them off too soon, and even reuse them? No, it's not the fault of public schools. They don't teach that. This goes back to personal responsibility. Right now, all they teach in schools about guns is to stay away from them.

No teaching segment in public school encourages perverse use of whatever is warned about but in some cases (drugs, alcohol, tobacco, sex) the classes themselves have encouraged some students to fiddle around with stuff that other age/race/economically matched students without those classes stayed away from over the study period. What does that mean?

It means that some students will always push the boundaries with novel information. Cutting is a good example. When I was a kid/teen only kids with severe mental issues cut. These were kids who had such profound issues that they were in locked wards or under daily supervision (they were periodically psychotic or frankly suicidal).

Today, cutting is an experimental thing that many perfectly normal teen girls try when they feel rebellious and angry. Because so many try, so many more become addicted to it through the cultural baggage it's acquired over the past 20 years. What started out as a psychotic compensatory device has become a mainstream experimentation. Largely this is due to parents, schools, PSAs, etc., introducing the idea to otherwise naive children. They wanted to do good but they ended up doing bad inadvertently. This is why Hell is paved with good intentions.

[deudyurondame]

I think our culture is getting so afraid of guns that they're even afraid of cops. It's not just liberals pushing the issue. It's stuff like Newtown.

Yeah, they're even tearing the building down and rebuilding another one on the same footprint there.

[Lanie]

"Forbidden fruit" factor.

Aaaaannnnndddd, see above.

You're saying even if they teach to stay away from drugs that kids will want to buy them because it's forbidden? It sounds like they can't do anything right. What's the answer? Say nothing?

The worst thing I'd say about DARE is that it doesn't seem to work.

[Adam]

You're saying even if they teach to stay away from drugs that kids will want to buy them because it's forbidden?

Of course. That's why it's called "forbidden fruit." Remember that whole Book of Genesis thingy? Adam and Eve? Serpent? Ring any bells?

It sounds like they can't do anything right.

Pretty much.

What's the answer? Say nothing?

Do what we did for hundreds of years before: not rely on the school system (read: the ever-growing government) to be parents of children.

The worst thing I'd say about DARE is that it doesn't seem to work.

You've managed to find the answer, even if you don't realize it.

[Lanie]

Of course. That's why it's called "forbidden fruit." Remember that whole Book of Genesis thingy? Adam and Eve? Serpent? Ring any bells?

God should not have forbid them. He should have used reverse psychology and told Adam and Eve to go for it. lol.

Do what we did for hundreds of years before: not rely on the school system (read: the ever-growing government) to be parents of children.

At least we won't be paying money into it when kids get told no only to go do drugs anyway. The role of telling kids no so they can do it anyway is the parent's job. lol.

You've managed to find the answer, even if you don't realize it.

I guess I just have a hard time with the concept of doing nothing, Adam. Do you realize how many parents are drug dealers or users? Those kids need a mentor if nothing else. Maybe that's where more of our money should go if we use local money, mentor programs for kids who you might as well say don't have parents. Telling your kids no means nothing if you're late for a drug delivery meeting.