Did The U.S. Abandon Iraq?

[Michele]

Link

[scott]

Did The U.S. Abandon Iraq?

No.

[scott]

Did this idiot show why she chose to work for Obama?

Yep.

[scott]

"I'm just not going to go back down that road."

"I’m really not going to relitigate..."

This here is a true believer who has been fed talking points and was obviously hired for her prowess in regurgitating talking points.

[Michele]

"I'm just not going to go back down that road."

"I’m really not going to relitigate..."

This here is a true believer who has been fed talking points and was obviously hired for her prowess in regurgitating talking points.

I was listening to another youtube of her and thought..the Obama administration couldn't have found someone who could speak like a grown-up and not be so acerbic and condescending? Can you imagine having to listen to her voice 24/7 ???!

[Michele]

Did The U.S. Abandon Iraq?

No.

Scott, I'd love to hear what you think of the current situation in Iraq. Did anything go right and/or what went wrong?

[scott]

Scott, I'd love to hear what you think of the current situation in Iraq. Did anything go right and/or what went wrong?

Saddam is gone. We have the luxury of not knowing how bad things would be with him having a pivotal role in the often mentioned "Nexus of Terrorism." While that might be a talking point, it was a also real threat and it was communicated as such before Bush '43 was even on the national stage. It didn't matter who got elected, Saddam was going to be ousted. It was either going to be championed as a major policy move by Bush '43 or it was going to be enacted by Gore as a a result of international demand after the UN collapsed when the Oil for Food Scandal undermined the authority of the UN Security Council. It's not as if Gore ran an anti-war campaign and we see how much of a dove Obama has been (to his credit, btw).

So Saddam is gone, that one went right.

Iraq was at the time considered the most powerful force in the Middle East. I'm aware of the revisionism that has gone on since Saddam's military was completely routed, and that Iran was the *real* problem after that and that Iran was always the elephant in the room. I call bullshit, Iran was never considered the larger threat. I can't get too much into detail about this, but I can say that between 1988 and 1990 there were only a few Farsi students at DLI and there were a whole bunch of Arabic Linguists. I can also say that by 1995 (when I got out) there was never any quota of Farsi linguists that ever had to be met by Military units deploying on Intelligence missions to the Middle East. We didn't even have any Farsi linguists available when we were right on the Iran-Iraq border.

The narrative about Iran was started in 2004 for political reasons when it was clear that Iraq was no longer a threat. The rumors about moving on to Iran were just that, rumors. Iran has always been a worry and there always has been a lingering concern about the Mullahs (who have no allegiance to any nation) taking control and filing the power vacuum, but that was always secondary to the direct military threat Iraq posed to our national security. Saddam was close to having a "hat trick;" his own national bank, France on the payroll, and oil.

It went bad when the PNAC contingent's ideas got moved to the front of the priority and what we know as "nation building" happened. That was the arrogance of government types that think they know better than the rest of us. Bush failed us as a nation when he refused to declare victory and either pull out or announce an occupation. He tried and fumbled with the "Mission Accomplished" speech and really didn't know what he was doing (IMO). It was a good speech and if he'd have followed through he would have lost the 2004 election but would have been a hero for going out "like a boss" (look it up), but some people convinced him that he could then pivot to a domestic agenda and he delegated Iraq to a group that was not concerned with securing the peace. This is the same group running things in Iraq now, but they don't need the military at this point (so it's all good right?).

Overall, it's still a huge net positive. We live under the luxury of not knowing how bad things would be with Bin Laden in charge of Iraq or Bin Laden being harbored by Saddam. Another major positive outcome from this was is that nobody thinks the US is a "paper tiger" and our current President has been able to exercise strong diplomacy in that new reality.

While I feel for the Iraqis, this is the nature of where they live. They are better off now than before unless they are part of the Sunni minority. If you're Sunni and you're still in Iraq and being harmed, you've done something wrong. There are plenty of tragic situations, but Sunnis were told to get out and were offered assistance to get to Syria where they would get amnesty. They stayed because this is where they built their lives and they thought things would normalize soon. Those that remained chose wrong and almost to the person they were terribly oppressive to their Shi'a neighbors. Those that were Sunni under Saddam were protected, sheltered, and subsidized - actual government stipends. Sunnis loved living in majority Shi'a regions because they were nobility. Now they are the equivalent of white trash and they are pissed, but they had a choice. They were offered assistance and refused to leave because they thought things were going to go back to the way they were. They chose wrong.

[Michele]

Thanks for that, Scott - very interesting.