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  • Students protest Confederate flag ban at Waldron high school

    Students protest Confederate flag ban at Waldron high school
    UPDATED 4:22 PM CDT Apr 09, 2014

    WALDRON , Ark. —A controversy in Waldron led to a parade of Confederate flags Tuesday evening to protest a ban implemented by officials at Waldron High School.

    Students who displayed the Confederate flag flying on the back of their pickup trucks were asked by school officials to remove them while on school property.

    The superintendent, Gary Wayman, said there have been complaints and some consider the display "offensive." Wayman said the students were flying the Confederate flags from the back of poles attached to their trucks.

    There were mixed feelings among students and others who gathered Tuesday to fly a parade of flags in protest.

    WATCH: Students fly Confederate flags in protest of school's policy

    Dakota Sims, an organizer of the parade in response to the ban, told 40/29 News "It's America, this is a free state. Like that flag represents freedom. Just like that American flag represents freedom. People died for both of them. Why not fly both of them?"

    Another student said he supports his friends that are protesting, but felt that the flags could send the wrong message.
    I totally "get" why Southerners and their friends see this flag as a symbol of southern culture and independence. I don't have a problem with it. Neither do I have a problem with the Norwegian national flag despite the long, tedious history of Norwegian aggression. Heck, I married one.

    What I don't "get" is how two or three people complaining can change policy for everybody. When Mexican students in Denver decided to hoist the Mexican flag on school grounds, thousands of people complained but it was allowed. How is that different?

    If dozens or hundreds of people think it's okay for the Confederate flag to be on cars or teeshirts or whatever, why can "a few" contra calls drive policy?

    4029TV



    Read more: http://www.4029tv.com/news/students-...#ixzz2yXvbznPu
    "Alexa, slaughter the fatted calf."

  • #2
    Selective enforcement of policies reflect the biases of whomever is making that decision.
    "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
    -John Locke

    "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
    -Newman

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Gingersnap View Post
      I totally "get" why Southerners and their friends see this flag as a symbol of southern culture and independence. I don't have a problem with it. Neither do I have a problem with the Norwegian national flag despite the long, tedious history of Norwegian aggression. Heck, I married one.

      What I don't "get" is how two or three people complaining can change policy for everybody. When Mexican students in Denver decided to hoist the Mexican flag on school grounds, thousands of people complained but it was allowed. How is that different?

      If dozens or hundreds of people think it's okay for the Confederate flag to be on cars or teeshirts or whatever, why can "a few" contra calls drive policy?

      4029TV



      Read more: http://www.4029tv.com/news/students-...#ixzz2yXvbznPu
      Whether it's the Confederate battle flag or a "Kiss Me I'm Irish" t-shirt, it's symbolic speech and we have Constitutional protection for it. The remedy for hate speech is more speech.

      However, the courts in their wisdom have seen fit to hold that students have limitations on their free speech rights that don't exist in other public places.

      Nonetheless, the guidelines must be specific and universal. If the school bans the Confederate flag because it disrupts, they must also ban the Mexican flag, the Union Jack and any other flag that isn't the US flag. And no, the Confederate flag (any of them) is NOT a US flag. It was the flag of what claimed to be a separate sovereign nation, or, in the alternative, a traitorous organization.

      Meanwhile, people need to get a grip. I would never agitate to force someone to remove their Confederate battle flag. As I informed HRH years ago, it tells you right away who to avoid. Most other assholes don't wear signs and you have to find out the hard way.
      "Since the historic ruling, the Lovings have become icons for equality. Mildred released a statement on the 40th anniversary of the ruling in 2007: 'I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, Black or white, young or old, gay or straight, seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about.'." - Mildred Loving (Loving v. Virginia)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Celeste Chalfonte View Post
        Whether it's the Confederate battle flag or a "Kiss Me I'm Irish" t-shirt, it's symbolic speech and we have Constitutional protection for it. The remedy for hate speech is more speech.

        However, the courts in their wisdom have seen fit to hold that students have limitations on their free speech rights that don't exist in other public places.

        Nonetheless, the guidelines must be specific and universal. If the school bans the Confederate flag because it disrupts, they must also ban the Mexican flag, the Union Jack and any other flag that isn't the US flag. And no, the Confederate flag (any of them) is NOT a US flag. It was the flag of what claimed to be a separate sovereign nation, or, in the alternative, a traitorous organization.

        Meanwhile, people need to get a grip. I would never agitate to force someone to remove their Confederate battle flag. As I informed HRH years ago, it tells you right away who to avoid. Most other assholes don't wear signs and you have to find out the hard way.
        So I guess all the other people who display the Mexican flag are people to avoid.

        I would not have come to that determination myself, but whatever. I'm sure the majority of people who display Mexican flags just like Mexico, Mexican culture, or feel some affiliation with the country. I bet that most of them are not involved in Reconquista.

        Similarly, most people who display Confederate flags do so because they identify with Southern culture, have an ancestral heritage involving the Confederacy, or simply enjoy a regional affiliation. I bet that most them are not involved in resurrecting slavery.

        "Alexa, slaughter the fatted calf."

        Comment


        • #5
          Personally, I see it as a difference between being inside the school and/or a part of school property vs. being outside the school.

          Want to fly the Confederate battle flag, or the Gadsden flag, or the French colonial flag, or the Union Jack, or the Lethoso flag on your car/truck/golf cart, your personal vehicle, in the school parking lot? Your deal, buddy; have at it.

          When you bring it into the school (or a school event), then the rules change. Put up a Mexican flag in your classroom? It better be a Spanish class or else some other such in which a flag like that is appropriate as a learning tool. We had a flagpole outside of every school I ever attended, and we gathered every morning to observe the raising of the US flag every day on that pole, where ever it was. If someone were raising the Mexican (or Norwegian or French or Russian or Australian) flag over the school property as the official flag of the school, then as far as I'm concerned, that's out of bounds. If a school hoists the Confederate battle flag as the official flag of the school, that's out of bounds. If someone puts up a Confederate battle flag in the classroom, then they'd better be teaching about Civil War history.

          I believe in school dress codes (decided locally, not at the federal level to be sure, and I'm nervous about state level). The right way to handle it is to say that students may wear a specific uniform. Teenagers being teenagers, they will find more and more ways to circumvent dress codes, the more those codes are enforced. So, the right answer is to give a basic set of guidelines. I'm completely fine with mandating that no student may wear upon their clothing a flag that is anything other than the currently-recognized flag of the United States. Wear the Mexican or the Rebel flag on your own time; when you're in school, you'll wear what we tell you to.
          It's been ten years since that lonely day I left you
          In the morning rain, smoking gun in hand
          Ten lonely years but how my heart, it still remembers
          Pray for me, momma, I'm a gypsy now

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Gingersnap View Post
            So I guess all the other people who display the Mexican flag are people to avoid.

            I would not have come to that determination myself, but whatever. I'm sure the majority of people who display Mexican flags just like Mexico, Mexican culture, or feel some affiliation with the country. I bet that most of them are not involved in Reconquista.

            Similarly, most people who display Confederate flags do so because they identify with Southern culture, have an ancestral heritage involving the Confederacy, or simply enjoy a regional affiliation. I bet that most them are not involved in resurrecting slavery.

            I think the difference between the Mexican and confederate flags is that one represents a sovereign nation and a cultural heritage while the other represents an illegitimate breakaway faction and is a battle flag, not a national flag, which is masquerading as cultural heritage.

            One is legit, one is uneducated and sour grapes.

            Either way, I support the kids' right to post the flag on their private vehicles. As Celeste said, it lets me know which myrmidons to avoid.
            “Any sufficiently advanced capitalism is indistinguishable from rent seeking.” ~ =j

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Adam View Post
              Personally, I see it as a difference between being inside the school and/or a part of school property vs. being outside the school.

              Want to fly the Confederate battle flag, or the Gadsden flag, or the French colonial flag, or the Union Jack, or the Lethoso flag on your car/truck/golf cart, your personal vehicle, in the school parking lot? Your deal, buddy; have at it.
              I disagree. It's the school parking lot. The school gets to decide. I don't agree with their response on this issue, but that is a substantive vs. procedural issue. I still think they get to decide.

              When you bring it into the school (or a school event), then the rules change. Put up a Mexican flag in your classroom? It better be a Spanish class or else some other such in which a flag like that is appropriate as a learning tool. We had a flagpole outside of every school I ever attended, and we gathered every morning to observe the raising of the US flag every day on that pole, where ever it was. If someone were raising the Mexican (or Norwegian or French or Russian or Australian) flag over the school property as the official flag of the school, then as far as I'm concerned, that's out of bounds. If a school hoists the Confederate battle flag as the official flag of the school, that's out of bounds. If someone puts up a Confederate battle flag in the classroom, then they'd better be teaching about Civil War history.

              I believe in school dress codes (decided locally, not at the federal level to be sure, and I'm nervous about state level). The right way to handle it is to say that students may wear a specific uniform. Teenagers being teenagers, they will find more and more ways to circumvent dress codes, the more those codes are enforced. So, the right answer is to give a basic set of guidelines. I'm completely fine with mandating that no student may wear upon their clothing a flag that is anything other than the currently-recognized flag of the United States. Wear the Mexican or the Rebel flag on your own time; when you're in school, you'll wear what we tell you to.
              Agreed on all this. "When I was a kid....insert old person comment here...." But we really didn't have too much of an issue with appropriate dress. Sure, some of the farm kids came in in "dungarees" and t-shirts that my mother wouldn't allow me to have as play clothes, nevertheless school clothes. But mostly kids dressed appropriately (I do recall one of the tarty type girls being sent home for wearing a t shirt, no bra, and large arm holes in the t-shirt so that everyone could see what she barely covered up. One kid was finally told by a substitute teacher to take his John Deer cap off in class (I had literally never seen him without a hat on before that time). But generally we all dressed much more appropriately than kids do today. No sweat pants to school. No short shorts (I was never permitted to wear shorts to school except towards the end, and they were true bermuda shorts, down to my knees, and my guess is that my mother was working and didn't see me either leaving for school or coming home). There were at least 2 Confederate flags on pick up trucks in our school parking lot. Honestly, those kids weren't racists...the Dukes of Hazard was huge with teen boys!
              Not where I breathe, but where I love, I live...
              Robert Southwell, S.J.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Tom Servo View Post
                I think the difference between the Mexican and confederate flags is that one represents a sovereign nation and a cultural heritage while the other represents an illegitimate breakaway faction and is a battle flag, not a national flag, which is masquerading as cultural heritage.

                One is legit, one is uneducated and sour grapes.

                Either way, I support the kids' right to post the flag on their private vehicles. As Celeste said, it lets me know which myrmidons to avoid.
                I disagree. People like to wear the Jamaican flag. Do we associate it with the worst possible aspects of Jamaica or Jamaican people? No. We generally assume that you like to smoke pot and listen to Jamaican music. The Confederate Flag can also mean that you like to smoke pot and listen to southern music. The fact that it's a flag of rebellion, even a failed rebellion, guarantees that it will be a favorite of rebels.

                The funny thing is that the South was the underdog. The people who hate the Confederate Flag, the white people anyway, tend to be granola crunchers who love underdogs and hate America. They love the Palestinians, because they lost. They hate Israel, as a proxy for America. So why don't they love the Confederates?

                The bottom line is that the Confederate Flag is the choice of millions of people as a symbol of regional and national identity. As is typical, if you are a black nationalist, it's about pride, if you are a white (or American) nationalist it's about hate. Fuck that.
                The year's at the spring
                And day's at the morn;
                Morning's at seven;
                The hill-side's dew-pearled;
                The lark's on the wing;
                The snail's on the thorn:
                God's in his heaven—
                All's right with the world!

                Comment


                • #9
                  I would have a Confederate flag on my truck, except that I don't want it to be vandalized. What does that tell you about the people who don't like the Confederate flag?
                  The year's at the spring
                  And day's at the morn;
                  Morning's at seven;
                  The hill-side's dew-pearled;
                  The lark's on the wing;
                  The snail's on the thorn:
                  God's in his heaven—
                  All's right with the world!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Novaheart View Post
                    I would have a Confederate flag on my truck, except that I don't want it to be vandalized. What does that tell you about the people who don't like the Confederate flag?
                    Six of one...rainbow flag would get your truck vandalized by a lot of people whose trucks sport the Confederate flag. What does that tell you about people who DO like the Confederate flag?
                    "Since the historic ruling, the Lovings have become icons for equality. Mildred released a statement on the 40th anniversary of the ruling in 2007: 'I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, Black or white, young or old, gay or straight, seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about.'." - Mildred Loving (Loving v. Virginia)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      'Peeing Calvin' Decals Now Recognized As Vital Channel Of National Discourse

                      Throughout its 224-year history, America has had many channels of discourse, its citizens expressing themselves by means ranging from pamphlets to protests, newspaper editorials to televised debates. In recent years, however, a significant new avenue of expression has emerged: "Peeing Calvin" decals.

                      Originally appearing on trucks as a salvo in the age-old Ford-Chevy debate, the popular stickers–which feature a bootlegged image of "Calvin" from the Bill Watterson comic strip Calvin & Hobbes urinating on a rival brand–have expanded to depict Calvin expressing urinary disapproval of a dazzling array of offenders.
                      Enjoy.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                        'Peeing Calvin' Decals Now Recognized As Vital Channel Of National Discourse

                        Throughout its 224-year history, America has had many channels of discourse, its citizens expressing themselves by means ranging from pamphlets to protests, newspaper editorials to televised debates. In recent years, however, a significant new avenue of expression has emerged: "Peeing Calvin" decals.

                        Originally appearing on trucks as a salvo in the age-old Ford-Chevy debate, the popular stickers–which feature a bootlegged image of "Calvin" from the Bill Watterson comic strip Calvin & Hobbes urinating on a rival brand–have expanded to depict Calvin expressing urinary disapproval of a dazzling array of offenders.
                        The Onion - gotta love that 2005 edge.
                        "Alexa, slaughter the fatted calf."

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Yeah, it's not fresh and modern like the confederate flag.
                          Enjoy.

                          Comment

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